Weekly call about Karrot development 2023

Karrot Meetings
#1

Date: 2023-01-06 19:30 CET
Where: Jitsi Meet
Facilitator: Nathalie
Minutes: Nick
Participants: Daniel, Nathalie, Nick, Bruno

1. Opening

2. Consent to agenda

  • 2 min

3. Review last week’s Actions/Outcomes

  • 5 min
  • put the decision of not supporting the app on Play Store on the agreements list [Nathalie]
    • it’s here! Karrot
    • we had a term of 4 months
    • I set both the “active to” and “review” fields to april → we will review it when the term ends
    • we can think of the best usage of those fields in the future
  • write something on Karrot and get feedback on this workflow [Bruno]
    • started working on this in the co-working
    • new category on forum
    • what is it about?
      • how to organise the feedback we get
      • eveluate the level where it should go
      • workflow: receive feedback in Karrot group
      • curate this content and put it on the forum
      • organise by topic
      • it will take shape as we go
    • suggestion for this structure on the forum
    • Log: incoming feedback in raw format
      • issue of privacy
      • ask person first if we may put it on the forum
      • or just get url of the thread
    • About the Feedback and ideas category - #2 by bruno

4. Discussion points

  • festival plans within the Erasmus+ project [E]

    • fetival idea is part of Erasmus+ project of 60kEUR
    • runs out november, most money spent in/by august
    • project co-ordinators paid a few hundred per month, money will not last so long
    • project co-ordinator per country, Daniel co-ordinates for luxembourg
    • festival planned to be in august
    • focused on: belgrium, luxembourg, germany
    • the festival is only 1/3 of the whole project
    • some more possiblities on how Karrot could collaborate with this
      • 1st obvious one is festival, will be in luxembourg in the countryside
        • want some time dedicated for people only in the foodsaving community,pre-festival perhaps
        • then “cola” (collaborate) festival, merging the two festivals
        • so having a foodharing village for the festival
        • curent thinking is 1st day closed, 2nd/3rd day open to general pulic
        • so workshops for general public later, foodsaving, sociocracy, etc
        • could be an opportunity for karrot people to meet, could have a stand, workshops, etc
 workshops could be for movement or general public
        • very flexible state right now :slight_smile: ideas welcome
        • fairly offgrid festival, so less good for focused computer stuff
        • size of festival? 50 people from foodsaving, movement, and more for general festival, 300-400 at least (ther pepole said no problem for 2000,3000 people)
        • who is co-ordinator for germany? Jonas Heintz, ambassadar for saarbrucken, in leuven Bianca Drepper
        • festival would be over a weekend
        • childcare considerations? not planned yet
      • could also do stuff before the festival
        • would be cool to meet in belgium/luxembourg before
 foodsavin leuven is also involved, could have a weekend to ourselves
        • daniel already met with leuven, and discussed problems they have with karrot
        • problems they both encounter with big groups
    • Q: how do you deal with language? english as a common language
    • Q: the bit before the meeting? could karrot make use of some of the funding for travel? (sleeping could be elsewhere?), have money for travelling, could imagine finding a thing for us coming, Daniel would think to provide room/food/etc, up for discussion
    • Q: is it open to other countries to participate? can have different target groups. most of the money needs to go to the 3 countries, but could pay for people not from those countries to give a workshop, festival itself will be totally open, just more financial support for people from those countries
    • bruno is surprised that Leuven is so big now! ~250 peeps
    • reactions!
      • Bruno: yayaaaaayayayyyy! very good idea! would be very happy to join, current situation is tough to leave for foreign lands having 2 small kids, not completely unlikely, seems a great opportunity! exited and supportive for everybody else, yeah, will see if maybe can make it, weekend makes it more likely, would be fun to be able to bring franz, maybe with informal childcare
      • Nick: sounds really exciting, enthusiastic, brewing the idea to go on a trip and visit groups myself, meeting in person is very important, trip with a purpose, would be good anker points, first bit as a ‘business meeting’ and also making connections with Leuven, Vas might be really interested too, festival sounds connecting, pluging into an wider community, appropriate for Karrot to have a presence
      • Nathalie: pretty amazing! a bit overwhelmed by the potential of this funding, and a new experience to have such a big pot of money, esp. in the context of the festival (also with some mixed feelings in there), really nice to think of karrot and the connection, so would be great to be at the festival and do something. for the other meeting, got excited before about going to göteborg, how many team meetings do we want to do though? is 2x to luxembourg too much? could connect at the festival? and see each other in another place in europe? 50 people from foodsaving movement is way too small, could be many more who are interested (particular from german side), people travelling from all over Germany for foodsharing.de festival in Berlin. people might be up for joining from further away depending on how it is explained. some talks about it how aligned with foodsharing festival
      • Daniel: happy to hear we find it cool, both ideas :slight_smile: how can we make it that both things work. more productive focus for pre-meeting and could work on something concrete, and festival more leisure. depends on how we are and how we want to set the focus. if trying to do stuff at the festival, they will be busy and/or not even present as lots will be going on. probably will meet cool people at festival.
      • Vasilis in Nicks head: enthusiastic to meet :slight_smile: how to deepen our relationships with groups
      • Bruno: rather focus on meeting Leuven, Luxembourg, more of a productive meeting, ideally doign both but maybe not having the time
    • is there a deadline for us to decide?
      • festival: hear back in February
      • other meeting: 2 weeks from now, so Daniel can put it into the budget, meeting can happen anytime

  • message input bug update [R]

  • knowledge sharing: how to enable feature flag features [E] [Nathalie]

    • at the moment it’s in the database
    • opening a python shell and manipulating the data
    • Nick loves sharing the knowledge
    • maybe not the most useful thing to know
    • given a limited time: focus on how to enable it for groups to do it themselves
    • 2 types
      • on/off (agreements)
      • more than on/off (roles) - configure name etc
        • that would need an interface in the settings
        • another tab where activity types are
    • start mocking up an user interface would be more useful
    • support groups on how to use these features
    • help people learning more tech stuff
    • reactions:
      • Nathalie: glad to finally talk about it! nice to know what it actually involves (a python shell on the server), nice to think about where we put our energy, motivation to learn about it shifted, nick and tilmann seem available enough to do it if needed, although would be more people to do. interface would make it obsolete.
      • Bruno: interesting to hear about the role feature, didn’t know how configurable it was with just a missing interface, and available for adding as many roles as the group likes, would be possible to configure more roles for the group (but the user interface for giving trust for other roles is not generic yet)
      • Daniel: also interesting to hear, but no pressure

  • call with recup [R]

    • link to minutes
    • maybe another Karrot group soon!
    • we got two emails from groups in Italy right after each other, each had a diferent vibe
    • other group more grassroots/activist/phd mission-aligned stuff
    • recup doing a lot of foodsaving, in rome and milan, with ~80 volunteers (not sure if across both cities or not), do pickups and want to expand, they have different channels on a messanger, and sign into pickups via a google form.
    • had a call with someone from recup and someone from frankfurt, pushing for recup to use a more specific software tool, felt like nice advertising for karrot :slight_smile:
    • a sense maye governance features, e.g. application, membership review, a bit overwhelming, currently in a process to figure out their goverance
    • hard to find the balance of telling them about governance features vs telling them about the core activity-related features
    • vasilis was encouraging them to just open a group
      • they have a rome group! → Karrot
    • fun to do these kind of calls, esp. when there are groups already
    • get quite a few emails from individuals on the forum, but that can be a long path to getting started, so nice when there is a group already there
    • reactions/questions/comments:
      • Daniel: is it the first foodsaving/foodsharing group in italy? (there are groups
 but the unique thing in recup is being in 2 cities, so mostly very local activities. there are some inactive groups in italy.).
      • Bruno: wondering if italy has more informal stuff, e.g. in Spain experienced more informal relationships with stores, and a lot of individual foodsaving, like dumpster diving, informal relationships where someone knows someone working in the shop. level of organisation might be related to the culture. interesting to hear about recup. would be nice to do a followup, applying to group, seeing what goes forward. there is a followup call scheduled on march 21st.
      • Nick: so many things going on under the radar, different cultures and different countries, in UK big NGOs see to be popular, motivating to hear that smaller groups exist, how to introduce the governance stuff? experienced this myself, 18 people on group now, didn’t mention governance tools to them, is there an overall governance principle for Karrot, we could point people to those resources

UP next

  • where do we store our agreements (forum, Karrot team, both) and how do we keep them updated (if more than one place) [E/D] [Nathalie]
    • intro: the money agreement we had on the forum, the app/PWA agreement we have as an agreement in the group. Nathalie added the money agreement to the group agreements too. Do we maintain both places for agreements? To which one do we (as a team) refer primarily?

5. Actions/Outcomes

  • engage with feedback workflow on forum [Bruno et al]

6. Closing Ceremony

  • 10 min
  • checkout

Appendix

What the letters mean

[R] Report (clarifying the information) - one person telling something to everyone, so everyone gets clarity on the subject, can ask questions, but not really discussion, etc

[E] Exploration (hearing reactions & ideas) - share our opinions, reactions, hear what everyone things, what’s on our mind
[D] Decision (making a decision) - final step to bring it together to a decision

List of ideas

  • making a tutorial(s), writing a manual/ handbook
  • future roadmap, plan
    • general direction for Karrot in the future? the conceptual part? more solid conceptual framework
  • in-person meeting \o/
  • ‘Legalizing’ Karrot? Building a legal structure we can use?
    • bank account/ legal structure, open collective
  • governance structure of Karrot/ Karrot ‘team’
  • Server structure, connection with foodsharing.de and Kanthaus
  • sociocracy and Karrot
  • how sociocracy could support groups
  • idea of commons
    • if there are shared resources in a group = commons (e.g. a cargo bike) can this be supported by karrot. e.g. a feature for shared items? \
  • finding partnerships to do some on the ground testing. related to a funding or part maybe. (the idea that Nick explained recently), a network, a movement, outreach a more specific one
    • outreach: establish network and partnerships, maybe connecting with local movements
  • re-contextualise Karrot towards a more-generalised tool
  • a mind map of these ideas, to visualize and revisit them → have a focused session on this
  • Privacy Policy
Weekly call about Karrot development 2022
#2

Date: 2023-01-13 19:30 CET
Where: Jitsi Meet
Facilitator: Vas
Minutes: everyone
Participants: Vas, Nathalie, Sven, Nick

1. Opening

  • 10 min Check in
  • 5 min ADMIN
    • attendance (write down participants)
    • duration: 1h30 total
    • information: any (non-karrot) announcements? unavailabilities?
    • next meeting:
      • next Wednesday co-working [vas], [nathalie]
      • next Friday general: yes
    • pick facilitamtor for next week: you? your karrot needs you!: Nick

2. Consent to agenda

  • 2 min

3. Review last week’s Actions/Outcomes

  • 5 min
  • engange with feedback workflow on forum [Bruno et al]

4. Discussion points

  • getting a beer from the fridge [ANYONE]
  • where do we store our agreements (forum, Karrot team, both) and how do we keep them updated (if more than one place) [E/D] [Nathalie]
    • intro: the money agreement we had on the forum, the app/PWA agreement we have as an agreement in the group. Nathalie added the money agreement to the group agreements too. Do we maintain both places for agreements? To which one do we (as a team) refer primarily?
    • Nathalie: if it would be possible to bridge in between both. On the forum its still good. Agreements on the group the main place, forum the extra communication. Automatic updated thing?
    • Nick: expand the topic out a bit: karrot group that relates in the forum. each tools offer something, missmash of tools to use. Buidling Karrot and use karrot, so makes me think what in the forum is really useful. The fact that is public is the main thing. transparency culture (unity stuff). missing if those info are not publicly available. Why karrot is so closed? (the group). Karrot team and feedback? Click around with no account? quite fitting and more transparent? If that was the case would it be sufficient? A public view only. Whole thing, sections? Not all or nothing, or some stuff? public activities? publish agreements by default? Bigger topic? How to support more transparency? Presnet reality, I like the feauture its a nice thing to have as the official agreement inside the Karrot team, forum gives the transparency. Not spend the time to do an automated thing, if it was easy the benefit would be there.
    • Vasilis: thinking a bit about the karrot team group being private, the application proess is quite nice as a welcoming step
  • sven asked: hi Im just here for some questions meanwhle after my recent first visit at that meeting (while those questions refer about new user signups but aren’t mentioned in faq, policy nor that third similar section?)
  • festival/ Karrot meeting(s)
    • two seperate things
    • update/summary: Daniel joined, presented thoughts: 1. more focused meeting, productive, focused on what we do; big groups e.g. Leuven. Needs to know in the next week: in person meeting in Belgium. 2. A festival which would be broader; funding is german speaking countries. August, somewhere. Will go ahead. 1st one productive stuff and focus, festival we attend, good for social stuff but less focus on Karrot maybe. People that where there.
    • Nick: interested to attend both, Bruno quite constrained by childcare; support either with childcare.
    • Nathalie: Funding comes from Erasmus+ comes through foodsharingAkademie, cooperation with Lux. How I got it is that we can use this funding meeting belgium, luxemburg, ? thing. Coordinators, 3 country coordinators. I would join both.
    • Vasilis: I would join both. festival idea seems far away, meetup would need some more co-ordination from our side, we could prepare a workshop. put idea on table: as belgirum and luxembourg are close, could go to some pickups with people, see how they run things and do distributions. don’t want to just go into a room and just talk about karrot, how we get maximum out of it. if it’s possible to combine both countries. did daniel mention duration?
    • Nick: maybe idea to do interview, or video

  • Call with open systems lab
  • update from Codeforsociety?
    • applied, waiting to hear if accepted, no updates

5. Actions/Outcomes

  • decision to make the karrot group the official place for agreements, and we copy them to the forum
  • transfer the PWA agreement to the forum [Nathalie]
  • Nathalie got promoted from moderator to admin on the forum [Yay!]
  • find a place where we can have disc to organise it? Karrot? a thread could be enough [Nick]
    • clarify what the offer is? how is going to interact with the structure?
  • nick will share the meeting time with social systems lab if anybody wants to join [Nick]

6. Closing Ceremony

  • 10 min
  • checkout

Appendix

What the letters mean

[R] Report (clarifying the information) - one person telling something to everyone, so everyone gets clarity on the subject, can ask questions, but not really discussion, etc

[E] Exploration (hearing reactions & ideas) - share our opinions, reactions, hear what everyone things, what’s on our mind
[D] Decision (making a decision) - final step to bring it together to a decision

List of ideas

  • making a tutorial(s), writing a manual/ handbook
  • future roadmap, plan
    • general direction for Karrot in the future? the conceptual part? more solid conceptual framework
  • in-person meeting \o/
  • ‘Legalizing’ Karrot? Building a legal structure we can use?
    • bank account/ legal structure, open collective
  • governance structure of Karrot/ Karrot ‘team’
  • Server structure, connection with foodsharing.de and Kanthaus
  • sociocracy and Karrot
  • how sociocracy could support groups
  • idea of commons
    • if there are shared resources in a group = commons (e.g. a cargo bike) can this be supported by karrot. e.g. a feature for shared items? \
  • finding partnerships to do some on the ground testing. related to a funding or part maybe. (the idea that Nick explained recently), a network, a movement, outreach a more specific one
    • outreach: establish network and partnerships, maybe connecting with local movements
  • re-contextualise Karrot towards a more-generalised tool
  • a mind map of these ideas, to visualize and revisit them → have a focused session on this
  • Privacy Policy
#3

Date: 2023-01-20 19:30 CET
Where: Jitsi Meet
Facilitator: Nathalie
Minutes: Nathalie
Participants: Nathalie, Nick, Sven

1. Opening

  • 10 min Check in
  • 5 min ADMIN
    • attendance (write down participants)
    • duration: 1h00 total - as short as possible
    • information: any (non-karrot) announcements? unavailabilities?
      • Nick 3-week countdown of working
    • next meeting:
      • next Wednesday co-working: yes
      • next Friday general: yes
    • pick facilitator for next week: you? your karrot needs you!: Nick

2. Consent to agenda

  • 2 min

3. Review last week’s Actions/Outcomes

  • 5 min
  • engange with feedback workflow on forum [Bruno et al]
  • decision to make the karrot group the official place for agreements, and we copy them to the forum
  • transfer the PWA agreement to the forum [Nathalie]
  • Nathalie got promoted from moderator to admin on the forum [Yay!]
  • find a place where we can have disc to organise meeting in Lux? Karrot? a thread could be enough [Nick]
    • Nick made a post in he Karrot group
    • it’s on Daniels side
    • ball is in his court
  • nick will share the meeting time with social systems lab if anybody wants to join [Nick]
    • meeting happened!

4. Discussion points

Today:

  • question about emails in the forum [Nathalie]
    • if someone writes an email and it comes to our email section in the forum and then also registers
    • do they see the whole email conversation thread?
    • will my reply be also send by email?
    • someone liked a reply I’ve written and I got confused about visibility
    • but it’s sweet if they do see the whole thread themselves
    • note: I could also do a bit of testing myself

    • Nick: don’t know exactly, forum works that everything is a forum thread. for emails coming in: creates staged user, only has email address, what I guess happened: staged account converts into real one. private message thread is now like a ‘normal’ message thread, default is likely that an email is sent each time
    • forum is discourse (software) not discord
  • open new topic “Weekly call about Karrot development 2023” and move calls from January
    • Nathalie could do in next co-working - yes please
  • report on social systems lab [Nick]
    • call with Tim in Cape town
    • they are building a tool called “circles”
      • big picture: people who want to make a better world make profiles
      • possible way to find group to fund
    • very positive about Karrot - we have actual users!
    • everyone continues doing their thing :slight_smile:
    • maybe funding opportunity for Karrot?
    • Hylo also a similar software
    • Reactions:
      • the topic of how to get funding is interesting
      • a bit of talk about buying abandoned buildings to make cool things
      • stay connected and have a sense of what’s going on is nice
      • really confusing this world of funding
      • maybe interesting to look into Hylo
      • a bit of talk about crypto investment
      • approach reminds me of effective altruism
  • group asks us to remove users from group [Nick]
    • talk general now
    • Nick got an email, maybe it will be sent to info@karrot.world
    • we might want to have a policy
      • do we intervene with group membership/ how much
      • we refused in the past
    • implement a feature would be ideal
      • emergency removal?
      • input for feature discussion
      • membership review not appropriate for all cases?
    • Q:
      • How time critical? wasn’t mentioned, they will likely send an email to the karrot mail
    • conversation:
      • tricky
      • wary about being overwhelmed with the situation/ of long emails
      • is getting information already getting involved?
      • first reaction: NO, would need to think about it more
      • again: policy would be good!
        1)
        - no we won’t do it
        - we can understand need and try to incorporate it into feature
        2)
        - no we won’t do it in general
        - we can understand need and try to incorporate it into feature
        - we have an emergency procedure for removal of group members
      • what is not working with the membership review?
      • we don’t want to be part of the group’s governance, also that’s not how Karrot is build
      • what about technical request?
        • if they figured it all out and it’s only about the technical removal only
        • they’re internal governance differes from what the software offers
      • relation to foodsharing is interesting, what can we learn?
      • what about if this happens to ‘Karrot Team and Feedback’? there is no other group we could ask

Next:

  • money review February 2023
    • Nick: 100€
    • Nathalie: 400€
    • Bruno: 200€
    • Vas: 230€
    • account: 17 824,98€ on 18.01.2023 (Nick still needs to do the transfer for January)
  • Nathalie encourages everyone to use the feedback feature after activities :slight_smile:
  • decline application from Adrian and sorayavw to Karrot Team and Feedback group due to lack of communication and say that they can re-apply any time [Nathalie]

5. Actions/Outcomes

  • engage with feedback workflow on forum [Bruno et al]
  • open new topic “Weekly call about Karrot development 2023” and move calls from January
    • Nathalie could do in next co-working
  • update meeting dates in forum intro post [Nathalie]

6. Closing Ceremony

  • 10 min
  • checkout

7. Conversation after the meeting

  • two questions about the profile [Sven]
    • Nathalie and Sven will stay and discuss
    • do we need both Username and Display name? on karrot.world
      • yes
    • change Display name later is possible
    • can not change Username later
      • add to registration page info about Username and Display?
      • implement to change Username later on?
    • it needs 3 characters
    • can not search users across groups
    • email address always visible in profile
      • Sven would like to hide email address in profile
      • reason not to make an account now
      • we heard that request before
    • community forum: sort ‘time read’ in userlist Karrot Community
      • Sven: sort by “all time”, right section “time read” stays fixed on top somehow, others are sortable instead

Appendix

What the letters mean

[R] Report (clarifying the information) - one person telling something to everyone, so everyone gets clarity on the subject, can ask questions, but not really discussion, etc

[E] Exploration (hearing reactions & ideas) - share our opinions, reactions, hear what everyone things, what’s on our mind
[D] Decision (making a decision) - final step to bring it together to a decision

List of ideas

  • making a tutorial(s), writing a manual/ handbook
  • future roadmap, plan
    • general direction for Karrot in the future? the conceptual part? more solid conceptual framework
  • in-person meeting \o/
  • ‘Legalizing’ Karrot? Building a legal structure we can use?
    • bank account/ legal structure, open collective
  • governance structure of Karrot/ Karrot ‘team’
  • Server structure, connection with foodsharing.de and Kanthaus
  • sociocracy and Karrot
  • how sociocracy could support groups
  • idea of commons
    • if there are shared resources in a group = commons (e.g. a cargo bike) can this be supported by karrot. e.g. a feature for shared items? \
  • finding partnerships to do some on the ground testing. related to a funding or part maybe. (the idea that Nick explained recently), a network, a movement, outreach a more specific one
    • outreach: establish network and partnerships, maybe connecting with local movements
  • re-contextualise Karrot towards a more-generalised tool
  • a mind map of these ideas, to visualize and revisit them → have a focused session on this
  • Privacy Policy
  • agreement feature and group governance [Nathalie]
#4

Date: 2023-01-27 19:30 CET
Where: Jitsi Meet
Facilitator: Nick
Minutes: Vasilis
Participants: Nick, Sven, Nathalie, Vasilis

1. Opening

  • 10 min Check in
  • 5 min ADMIN
    • attendance (write down participants)
    • duration: 50m for vas 30 past, 

    • information: any (non-karrot) announcements? unavailabilities?
      • Nick 2-week countdown of working
      • Nathalie certified sociocracy practitioner \o/
      • a bit of online communication between Nathalie and mariha about Karrot
    • next meeting:
      • next Wednesday co-working: Nathalie and Vas up for that
      • next Friday general: yes
    • pick facilitator for next week: you? your karrot needs you!: Vas

2. Consent to agenda

  • 2 min

3. Review last week’s Actions/Outcomes

4. Discussion points

  • meeting format - open questions in beginning and then carry on to other topics in smaller round?

    • giggles nature of the call. Intro session in the beginning. Unsure when I know that someone needs more time to come to the same level. Feeling of uneasyness.
      • vas: get the point, don’t have a suggestion right now, when joined the group felt a bit excluded through lack of information, over time could participate in more topics, was interesting, found my way without having someone mentoring
      • nick: acceptance to the flow, how does a more intentional approach would look? Karrot energy low at the moment due to paid work, proper onboarding would be nice, we don’t have that, being realistic at the moment what I can do
      • sven: this call is public, can I share a link to the forum?
      • nathalie: thinking about what the “karrot team” is, and wanting a bit more formalised idea of what this is, would appreciate a clearer intention, not so comfortable with the openness/fluidity
      • vas: 2 points, direct towards sven: 4th meeting having joined, would be interested in feedback, how included, excluded, what could help out, to gradually to feel more mutually comfortable, 2nd point, about sharing link to other people who want to join, at the moment couldn’t imagine how to combine a meeting with specific organising, and new people that haven’t used karrot, don’t see it working, or good use of time, can’t introduce karrot to everyone and work on our tasks
      • nick: it all makes sense, right now quite fluid and open because I can’t do a lot Karrot, like having open space available, monthly community call would be that open space, would be nice to have those regular, would need resources to organise, right now we are minimally operating, in favor of clear intentions, reform intention of this call, helps clarify for people outside, no capacity to work at this topic at the moment
      • sven: planning to create a profile, let newcomers know that there is Karrot, notice errors and bugs, report tiny things, interested in meeting for newcomers
      • I do like the idea of the community calls, to seperate the spaces, newcomer call would improve the situation m

  • money review February 2023 [D]

    • Nick: 100€
    • Nathalie: 400€
    • Bruno: 200€
    • Vas: 230€
    • account: 17 824,98€ on 18.01.2023 (Nick still needs to do the transfer for January)
      • vas: has been great the last 3 months, an cover part of rent, can keep it how it is from my pov, would be glad, also open to discuss as group
      • nathalie: yes, it still feels like i ve been kind of constant, previously 300 and will like to stay at the same rate if ppl have no ‘objections’
      • Nick: will like to keep it the same amount for now, I d like to review it at some point but not atm
      • review money: in 2 months
      • we didnt ask bruno
but will assume ;D

  • Nathalie encourages everyone to use the feedback feature after activities :slight_smile: [R]

    • we all listen, nod, and smile (and will likely continue not using it, but maybe, just maybe we do :))

  • bump to next week:

  • decline application from Adrian and sorayavw to Karrot Team and Feedback group due to lack of communication and say that they can re-apply any time [Nathalie] [D]

  • changing series message experience [Nick] [R]

  • duplicate activities bug [Nick] [R]

  • Design process: next iteration roles feature [E/D]

  • Weekly meeting time [E/D]

5. Actions/Outcomes

  • update meeting dates in forum intro post [Nathalie]
  • Karrot days text [Vasilis]
  • reminder on Karrot for money review, end of march normal meeting [Nick]

6. Closing Ceremony

  • 10 min
  • checkout

Appendix

What the letters mean

[R] Report (clarifying the information) - one person telling something to everyone, so everyone gets clarity on the subject, can ask questions, but not really discussion, etc

[E] Exploration (hearing reactions & ideas) - share our opinions, reactions, hear what everyone things, what’s on our mind
[D] Decision (making a decision) - final step to bring it together to a decision

List of ideas

  • making a tutorial(s), writing a manual/ handbook
  • future roadmap, plan
    • general direction for Karrot in the future? the conceptual part? more solid conceptual framework
  • in-person meeting \o/
  • ‘Legalizing’ Karrot? Building a legal structure we can use?
    • bank account/ legal structure, open collective
  • governance structure of Karrot/ Karrot ‘team’
  • Server structure, connection with foodsharing.de and Kanthaus
  • sociocracy and Karrot
  • how sociocracy could support groups
  • idea of commons
    • if there are shared resources in a group = commons (e.g. a cargo bike) can this be supported by karrot. e.g. a feature for shared items? \
  • finding partnerships to do some on the ground testing. related to a funding or part maybe. (the idea that Nick explained recently), a network, a movement, outreach a more specific one
    • outreach: establish network and partnerships, maybe connecting with local movements
  • re-contextualise Karrot towards a more-generalised tool
  • a mind map of these ideas, to visualize and revisit them → have a focused session on this
  • Privacy Policy
  • agreement feature and group governance [Nathalie]
#5

Date: 2023-02-03 19:30 CET
Where: Jitsi Meet
Facilitator: Vasilis
Minutes: All
Participants: Vasilis, Bruno, Nathalie, Nick

1. Opening

  • 10 min Check in
  • 5 min ADMIN
    • attendance (write down participants)
    • duration: 20.00/21.00
    • information: any (non-karrot) announcements? unavailabilities?
    • next meeting:
      • next Wednesday co-working: YE
      • next Friday general:
    • pick facilitator for next week: you? your karrot needs you!: Bruno

2. Consent to agenda

  • 2 min

3. Review last week’s Actions/Outcomes

  • 5 min
  • engage with feedback workflow on forum [Bruno et al]
  • reminder on Karrot for money review, end of march normal meeting [Nick]

4. Discussion points

  • decline application from Adrian and sorayavw to Karrot Team and Feedback group due to lack of communication and say that they can re-apply any time [Nathalie] [D]

    • accept or decline? We never declined applications before - oh no we did decline!
    • Nick sugggest we decline them, Bruno as well since they either found their place or not or they are not on Karrot as well, keep it a bit clean with
      the applications, they can always apply again, go with my proposal to decline, Vasilis: decline them

  • changing series message experience [Nick]

    • local group bioregional, we use it for comuncations we have a 6month review period and I will try and facilitate a session, icrease the
      level of interaction, before it would be e-mails and cc, was daunting as such. Activities for coordinating is used and ppl sign up even 2 months in adcvance
      atm there is monthly meetings and wanted to change the time for one event of a series, so what the person did, someone changed the time for the whole activity and
      what happend is that it removed the activity and ppl get a notification/warning. This deleted the whole activity chat, I was frustrated with the event, I ended up not going to the meeting at all. Interesting experience of the feature. There is a githug issue to change the time in one event of a series, needs to change the code of how u generate activities.
      -Nathalie: experienced myself, with the co-working session, its a bit more tricky, feels normal to me to remove ppl from the slots if an event changes.
      -Bruno: Disable an activity? Show an activity as disabled. Of course the ppl should be notified somehow. A notification with a msg. I might agree with the chat bit that it stays there, it stays as a history thing.
      -Nick: 2 levels, 1st level disables activities but not deletes them 2nd regigging how the activities work that is quite sensitive code though. Might be worth making the 1st change before that.
    • see also Allow to change the time of individual activities within a series · Issue #2633 · karrot-dev/karrot-frontend · GitHub

  • duplicate activities bug [Nick] [R]

  • Deploy with bug fix? [D]

    • Bruno I was thinking about the editor when u type stuff. its on dev now. important fix we should try and put it live? More testing? Nick: its only partially fixed. Not deployed on dev. There is some work left to do then.

  • Design process: next iteration roles feature [E/D]

    • Design process place there was a msg, idea to work on the roles feature again, the trigger was that there could be more roles, but we dont know how it would look like. We dont really have a very clear picture of how roles would look like. Interested to work on this (Nathalie) and I would appreciate if its within the desing process. Bruno leading though it? We didnt yet talk about the time or the time frame. Didnt schedule a first call, either we try to schedule the 1st call or take about the timeframe

    • Bruno: could be slow tuesdays? in the coming weeks I ll have more free time during the day. Evenings are a safe bet, not wednesday, first on could be to just define the scope, the lenth, try to see how much work, sessions
 Preparatory session
    • Nick: I think its great, feeling a lot of appreciation, i think it can enable some nice organising, getting the head around it seems nice and i d like to able to support that from my side.
    • Vasilis: up for that

  • Weekly meeting time [E/D]

    • Nathalie: I think its friday meeting time was a compromise, I personally notice that is friday evening is getting to a point, I m on the edge, today was fine but sometimes is arched to the weekend so i dont have. I am bit happy with the evening, but not sure about the friday one.
    • Nick: Not a good feeling for me as well, but suprisingly energising, end up appreciating the ppl, what we speak
it is a nice boost. The only time to do it atm. I m
    • Bruno: Not the best time for me either, usually quite tired, easily end up forgetting about it. so we could change to another evening. Wait a couple of weeks ‘the ordeal will be over’ i d have more time soon, will know more less how my schedule will be. I suggest we wait for some weeks and we revisit that

  • Onboarding to Karrot calls/Karrot team [E] (next time)

  • Check how groups are doing with new features [E] (next time)

5. Actions/Outcomes

  • engage with feedback workflow on forum [Bruno et al]
  • upadete the git on changing series activities experience [Nick]
  • to open up the discussion on our Karrot group about a design series on roles feature? [Vasilis]

6. Closing Ceremony

  • 10 min
  • checkout

Appendix

What the letters mean

[R] Report (clarifying the information) - one person telling something to everyone, so everyone gets clarity on the subject, can ask questions, but not really discussion, etc

[E] Exploration (hearing reactions & ideas) - share our opinions, reactions, hear what everyone things, what’s on our mind
[D] Decision (making a decision) - final step to bring it together to a decision

List of ideas

  • making a tutorial(s), writing a manual/ handbook
  • future roadmap, plan
    • general direction for Karrot in the future? the conceptual part? more solid conceptual framework
  • in-person meeting \o/
  • ‘Legalizing’ Karrot? Building a legal structure we can use?
    • bank account/ legal structure, open collective
  • governance structure of Karrot/ Karrot ‘team’
  • Server structure, connection with foodsharing.de and Kanthaus
  • sociocracy and Karrot
  • how sociocracy could support groups
  • idea of commons
    • if there are shared resources in a group = commons (e.g. a cargo bike) can this be supported by karrot. e.g. a feature for shared items? \
  • finding partnerships to do some on the ground testing. related to a funding or part maybe. (the idea that Nick explained recently), a network, a movement, outreach a more specific one
    • outreach: establish network and partnerships, maybe connecting with local movements
  • re-contextualise Karrot towards a more-generalised tool
  • a mind map of these ideas, to visualize and revisit them → have a focused session on this
  • Privacy Policy
  • agreement feature and group governance [Nathalie]
#6

Date: 2023-02-10 19:30 CET
Where: Jitsi Meet
Facilitator: Bruno
Minutes: All
Participants: Vasilis, Bruno, Nathalie, Nick

1. Opening

  • 10 min Check in
  • 5 min ADMIN
    • attendance (write down participants)
    • duration: 1.30h, maybe shorter or stepping out earlier
    • information: any (non-karrot) announcements? unavailabilities?
      • 1-week countdown of work for Nick
      • Bruno “schooling in” (= helping them to integrate in pre-school) little humans
      • Nathalie looking into other softwares for Sociocracy for All
    • next meeting:
      • next Wednesday co-working: YES A! Vas maybe not, Nathalie will be there (probably)
      • next Friday general: seems like it
    • pick facilitator for next week: you? your karrot needs you!: Vas (but,
 )

2. Consent to agenda

  • 2 min

3. Review last week’s Actions/Outcomes

4. Discussion points

  • Mini Update from Daniel [R]

    • 14.02 meeting meeting, than we know more about our meeting
    • 18th august for festival mayybeee (psst)
    • meeting in Luxembourg/ Belgium - not decided yet

  • email from mariha, bring conversation to friday call, review existing rules? [Vas]

    • we don’t take notes here
    • give it a bit more time, we’ll revisit the topic next week!

  • continue conversation about how to join the Karrot Team in general [all]

    • Onboarding to Karrot calls/Karrot team [E]
    • trial pick-up in foodsharing, not to ‘test’ people, but to learn the culture
    • giving enough context to new people
    • thinking about own onboarding
    • frame conversation within our culture - get to know culture
    • Katies paper about Stockholm, people drained from doing onboarding over and over again
    • we shouldnt have really open mmeetings like drop in whenever u want. this can disrupt a lot, in terms of onboarding, a simple process or decision, weekly meeitngs are invite only? frame it in a different way, sounds quite ‘arogant’ by thet sounds of it, but if someone shows an interest that it makes sesnse, yeah letst talk about it, comes to the meeting, becoming part of the time is more orgnanic, as we walk develop and gather exp we see thins that work r not. somethings can be completely open or others can be ‘invite-only’ kind of thing. A comment, not anyparticular onnboarding process, i suggest maybe that we restrain the participation so maybe we remove some info: ‘if u want to join let us know’ have a pre-chat: that is a little bit of an onboarding process.
    • 2 things here: one-one with everyone or u have a person that is a mentor, take time and explain things, do enjoy onboarding, i need to know that ppl are slightly interested, generally thinking about membership, i changed my opionion, i do want to be able to say NO to ppl. How do we agree about a membership? I am bit biased ofc by governance things I m working on. In Karrot terms, karrot group isnt open. I would be fine to say like, apply to the group and there u find hte information. Use the approved feauture, also exited about making membership more clear, expectations are clearer ppl will encourage pll to join, providing clarity.
    • thinking about openess, making it easy for ppl to contribute, clearer statement of membership might encourage ppl, the case can be the opposite as well, The biggest challenge is to find nice dif levels of contribution. What does that mean?
    • power structures do exists!
    • build something international

  • Check how groups are doing with new features [E] (next time)

5. Actions/Outcomes

6. Closing Ceremony

  • 10 min
  • checkout
#7

Date: 2023-02-17 19:30 CET
Where: Jitsi Meet
Facilitator: -
Minutes: All
Participants: Nick, Nathalie

1. Opening

  • 10 min Check in
  • 5 min ADMIN
    • attendance (write down participants)
    • duration:
    • information: any (non-karrot) announcements? unavailabilities?
      • Nick has finished work project! (almost)
    • next meeting:
      • next Wednesday co-working: Nathalie will be there
      • next Friday general:
        • Nathalie won’t be present
        • Nick might be cycling, but maybe can join
    • pick facilitator for next week: you? your karrot needs you!: see who’s there

2. Consent to agenda

  • 2 min

3. Review last week’s Actions/Outcomes

  • 5 min

  • engage with feedback workflow on forum [Bruno et al]

4. Discussion points

  • Update from Daniel about meeting [R]
    • they decided the funding won’t cover a dedicated meeting
    • we can do something independent
    • Nathalie would be up for thinking about doing something
    • also previous idea we had about going to Gothenburg
    • unclear what the festival will consist of and what we would prepare for it, Nathalie quite clear to go to it, unless really small
    • not officially announced yet
  • proposal for mariha’s email

Next week:

  • continue conversation about how to join the Karrot Team in general [all]
  • check how groups are doing with new features [E] (next time)
  • new meeting time idea? [E]

5. Actions/Outcomes

  • Nick reply to Daniel about idea to organise independently for meeting, and also mention we’ll think about a workshop
  • wait for more reactions until next co-working time and reply to mariha [Nathalie]

6. Closing Ceremony

  • 10 min
  • checkout

Appendix

What the letters mean

[R] Report (clarifying the information) - one person telling something to everyone, so everyone gets clarity on the subject, can ask questions, but not really discussion, etc

[E] Exploration (hearing reactions & ideas) - share our opinions, reactions, hear what everyone things, what’s on our mind
[D] Decision (making a decision) - final step to bring it together to a decision

List of ideas

  • making a tutorial(s), writing a manual/ handbook
  • future roadmap, plan
    • general direction for Karrot in the future? the conceptual part? more solid conceptual framework
  • in-person meeting \o/
  • ‘Legalizing’ Karrot? Building a legal structure we can use?
    • bank account/ legal structure, open collective
  • governance structure of Karrot/ Karrot ‘team’
  • Server structure, connection with foodsharing.de and Kanthaus
  • sociocracy and Karrot
  • how sociocracy could support groups
  • idea of commons
    • if there are shared resources in a group = commons (e.g. a cargo bike) can this be supported by karrot. e.g. a feature for shared items? \
  • finding partnerships to do some on the ground testing. related to a funding or part maybe. (the idea that Nick explained recently), a network, a movement, outreach a more specific one
    • outreach: establish network and partnerships, maybe connecting with local movements
  • re-contextualise Karrot towards a more-generalised tool
  • a mind map of these ideas, to visualize and revisit them → have a focused session on this
  • Privacy Policy
  • agreement feature and group governance [Nathalie]
#8

Date: 2023-02-24 19:30 CET
Where: Jitsi Meet
Facilitator: Vas
Minutes: Vas and all
Participants: Vas, Nathalie, Nick, Bruno

1. Opening

  • 10 min Check in
  • 5 min ADMIN
    • attendance (write down participants)
    • duration: 9 CET, Nathalie leaves at 8:30 CET
    • information: any (non-karrot) announcements? unavailabilities?
    • next meeting:
      • next Wednesday co-working: Nathalie will be there, Vas as well
      • next Friday general:
    • pick facilitator for next week: you? your karrot needs you!: open to everyone/ Vas

2. Consent to agenda

  • 2 min

3. Review last week’s Actions/Outcomes

  • 5 min
  • engage with feedback workflow on forum [Bruno et al]
    • ongoing
  • Nick reply to Daniel about idea to organise independently for meeting, and also mention we’ll think about a workshop [Nick]
    • moved to discussion
  • wait for more reactions until next co-working time and reply to mariha [Nathalie]
    • done

4. Discussion points

  • new meeting time idea? [D]

    • we don’t like the fridays that much, was a compromise
    • Bruno: could do meetings during the day, almost everyweekday beteween 9-15.00 but not fridays or tuesdays. Evenings mondays and tuesdays
    • Nathalie: happy to move from friday. afternoons have calls. mostly mornings would work before 13.00-14.00. Could do mondays or tuesdays and tuesday evening.But wd prefer morning slots.
    • Nick: prefer mornings. Quite flexible. Not thursday morning. Early in the week slightly better, not wkends
    • Vasilis: avoid weekends, regular meeting monday morning, monday later, other mornings are ok, early on during the day
    • Proposal: Tuesday 10 CET? 9 UK time
    • yeah!
    • Q: Starting next week? yes!

  • Nick reply to Daniel about idea to organise independently for meeting, and also mention we’ll think about a workshop [E,R,D]

    • no funding for the meeting, but festival will happen, around mid august?
    • had the idea to do it anyway. use karrot money or no money
    • Nathalie: super nice t meet in person. doing it not in lux but in gotenburg.
      • team focus or engaging with groups?
      • organisational bit can be a burden maybe. depending on how much energy we put

    • bruno: come to gotemburg! but open for other places as well. Maybe define a deadline?
    • vasilis: would be fun to meet up, team focus/ group engaging?, likes the idea of göteborg, how open we want it to be? invite others? what could Bruno organise, maybe a community center to sleep in.
    • bruno could help with logistics for sleeping more people.
    • it would be nice to stay in the same place, share, cook etc if that is possible

  • festival/workshop [E]

    • Bruno: would be fun and fine! if its mid aug its maybe gonna be easier for me. sounds duable
    • Nick: Yes on my radar. hazy about what a workshop is.
    • Vasilis: Yes on my radar. hazy about what a workshop is.
    • Nathalie: Yes on my radar, i think in Luxmeburg, up for a wkshop but also up to hear from daniel more. i do think they also provide cost for workshops.

  • new rhythms? [E]

    • how to fit karrot in work life, provide financial situation
    • how do people feel about rythm of Karrot in their lives
    • work out what we need to do
    • time fo evolution? Karrot team definition, crowd funding
    • do other/ external work e.g. for tech coop or other orgs
    • Nathalie: forgot to take notes here
not sure how i feel about karrot sometimes, the priority it takes in my life
 CSX idea
    • Bruno: another wave of acitivity, planning and doing stuff, more time to plan and do things now, need for life designing
    • Vasilis: very interesting topic, how can Karrot become more of a daily part in our lives, when we got funding there was more energy there last year, we also had more pressure, that was bad, like to think about a more hybrid way, Karrot has potential for funding, other projects have more money than we do, can not write code, limited in participation to Karrot, transition would also require legal status esp. for
    • good project, worthy a push!
    • non-coding input is super valued
    • a lot of reflective space in Karrot, moving slowly
    • resilient way of doing things vs rocket ship to the moon

  • continue conversation about how to join the Karrot Team in general [E] [all]

  • check how groups are doing with new features [E] (next time)

  • find a time for design session/ retrospection session on roles feature [D]

  • funding oppertunity https://restwith.eu/open-call/ [E]

5. Actions/Outcomes

  • change activity series [Bruno]
  • change the forum post accordingly [Vas]
  • write to Daniel [Nathalie]
  • engage with the thread about festival and workshop [all]
  • engage again with the thread on new features ane suggest a time to meet and discuss and find a day for a co-working/design session [vas]
  • write an e-mail to https://restwith.eu/open-call/ [vas]

6. Closing Ceremony

  • 10 min
  • checkout

Appendix

What the letters mean

[R] Report (clarifying the information) - one person telling something to everyone, so everyone gets clarity on the subject, can ask questions, but not really discussion, etc

[E] Exploration (hearing reactions & ideas) - share our opinions, reactions, hear what everyone things, what’s on our mind
[D] Decision (making a decision) - final step to bring it together to a decision

List of ideas

  • making a tutorial(s), writing a manual/ handbook
  • future roadmap, plan
    • general direction for Karrot in the future? the conceptual part? more solid conceptual framework
  • in-person meeting \o/
  • ‘Legalizing’ Karrot? Building a legal structure we can use?
    • bank account/ legal structure, open collective
  • governance structure of Karrot/ Karrot ‘team’
  • Server structure, connection with foodsharing.de and Kanthaus
  • sociocracy and Karrot
  • how sociocracy could support groups
  • idea of commons
    • if there are shared resources in a group = commons (e.g. a cargo bike) can this be supported by karrot. e.g. a feature for shared items? \
  • finding partnerships to do some on the ground testing. related to a funding or part maybe. (the idea that Nick explained recently), a network, a movement, outreach a more specific one
    • outreach: establish network and partnerships, maybe connecting with local movements
  • re-contextualise Karrot towards a more-generalised tool
  • a mind map of these ideas, to visualize and revisit them → have a focused session on this
  • Privacy Policy
  • agreement feature and group governance [Nathalie]
#9

Date: 2023-03-07 19:30 CET
Where: Jitsi Meet
Facilitator: Vas
Minutes: Vas and all
Participants: Vas, Nathalie, Nick, Bruno
reth

1. Opening

  • 10 min Check in
  • 5 min ADMIN
    • attendance (write down participants)
    • duration: 1:30h, Bruno leaves 1h in
    • information: any (non-karrot) announcements? unavailabilities?
    • next meeting:
      • next Wednesday co-working: Nathalie will be there, Vas as well
      • next Tuesday general:
    • pick facilitator for next week: you? your karrot needs you!: Bruno

2. Consent to agenda

  • 2 min

3. Review last week’s Actions/Outcomes

4. Discussion points

  • time for the meeting [E,D]
    • Bruno: maybe we start 30mins earlier or check if can change the next thing
    • Nick: is up for trying 30 mins earlier but how about another day as well?
    • Nathalie: 30mins would work for me
    • Vasilis: 30mins earlier the same day
  • continue conversation about how to join the Karrot Team in general [E] [all]
    • What this topic is?
      • Nathalie: sometimes I do wish for places where the structures are clear, there is a lot of fluidity in Karrot, wonder if that is too much for me sometimes? How responsible I feel, effort I put? Is it just an open call? Do have a lot of sympathy for structure. Defining membership. Defined doesnt mean closed. Potential to the design feature of roles. Was wondering if we want to use this feature more e,g, approved can be karrot-team ppl, karrot friends etc. Governing members and asosciated members, my hope is to have more ppl engaged in the governance. The idea of growing the team but being open as well. a. Community org, b. software work?. More ppl coming into the technical. How a new developer get invlolves for example. Could it be a seperate circle?
      • I like the ideda of connecting with fosc.
      • Summary: will be happy having a better team definition.
      • Nick: reaction to above is excitment! Design our organisatinal structure. On the basis of sosiocracy. Use a sort of consent process to make a constitution of Karrot. The need of the contributors. The need of the users, the needs of software itself to be a viable entity. Transition point/inflection point to inform a structure that can better serve those needs. Personal situation: want to flow in money doing software that feels good to me. Some with Karrot, some working with tech coops.
      • Bruno: thinking along
I agree with the most, we need to start defining things, maybe a governing structure. ‘Who is part of the Karrot-team?’ Defining a membership team and consent. Finding other spaces for ppl to contribute. Democratising and participatory, general assembly? what are the fora the ppl can join to. How we incorporate the feedback? Its a process, we wont have answers now. We can start finding what the Karrot team is, what the scope is, what are the decisions.
      • write down some proposals/ideas. some concrete proposals.
      • Vas: lot of interesting comments, likes the momentum, move into a bit more structure, very amazed by fluid organising in the beginning, now becoming something more ‘concrete’, thinking about the idea of sociocracy, inital mapping, possible circles that could operate, how do you open up the process to groups? e.g. foodsaving Leuven - how could they participate?, rethink Design Session and prioritise this topic to design our organisation,
    • Wider org discussion?
    • Wider perspectives (LLink
)
    • what is the structure of Karrot going foward?
    • other money ideas, CSX, crowd, 
 [E]
      • Nick: would like to spend time on that. Organisational transformation in a concent way. Dont want that be rushed despite my personal scale. Can screw up the dynamics so I m consious of that. Article: women in os tech.
      • Def positive in finding more sources of funding.
        -Next steps ideas:
        • contact FOSC circle from Sociocracy for All: fosc.circle@sociocracyforall.org
        • do a mapping of Karrot and possible needs and circles
        • write some proposals
        • read more about CSX model: Gemeinschaftsgetragenes Wirtschaften – Aus Produzierenden und Konsumierenden wird eine Prosument*innengemeinschaft
        • explore different kinds of membership
        • collect together organisational structure models (e.g. article from John)
        • maybe open a forum thread?
        • Design Process on our governance
          -Nathalie: have a draft of csx to further discover. I m on this topic. Happy to thik of this, for us is fun to do the mapping things. Excited to get togethere with fosc and see what their prompts, questions. Idea of going through this together is beneficial for fosc as well.
          -Bruno: maybe we can aim to dedicate 30mins of each meeting where we continue on this. To keep it steady.
          -Vasilis: likes idea of getting connected with FOSC, external collaboration could give us a boost, interesting what they would say, different angle on Karrot, before reaching out to them: draft of what we are working on, make an extra document/ map of our topics and ideas, proposal: 30min in the next meetings, make something we can shar with external people and share it with FOSC later on. Writing down open questions and needs
        • Nick: do we plant sth first and get an external need? Needs first or a model that can hold our needs? Chicken or egg problem? Inherit messiness in this process. Little steps in different directions. Different diverse inputs. I feel limited whilst on the trip. I can imagine writing up some thoughts to go on the forum post. 30min standing agenda item. Check in ‘how is our csx learning exploraiton going?’.
      • Standing agenda point?
      • conctacting fosc people? try and get call after the 18th of March [Nathalie introduces each other]
      • jot down some thoughts [Nick to initiate that?]
  • check how groups are doing with new features [E] (next time)
    • can be a feedback session.
    • data: have groups using those new features? can we see that through grafana?
    • data is a bit to feed in more human processes. data can give a good initial sense.
    • unling the feedback session to design sessions. make a community cafe style feedback session?
    • community cafe? a meeting with groups?
    • a community cafe is beyond karrot? can be sharing experiences about foodsaving/sharing.
    • starting point with the ppl that we already engaged. Dave daniel or more ppl? see if they want to participate. General feedback with a special curiosity on new features. Improvements ideas. Could fit in the process of collecting feedback.
    • could be called a feedback session
    • make a time poll for a feedback session
  • find a time for design session/ retrospection session on roles feature [D]
    • would like to discuss roles vs membership

5. Actions/Outcomes

  • change the forum post accordingly [Vas]
  • chnage the activity series [bruno]
  • write to Daniel [Nathalie]
  • engage with the thread about festival and workshop [all]
  • engage again with the thread on new features ane suggest a time to meet and discuss and find a day for a co-working/design session [vas]
  • conctacting fosc people? try and get call after the 18th of March [Nathalie introduces each other]
  • jot down some thoughts [Nick to initiate that?]
  • make a time poll for a feedback session [vas]

6. Closing Ceremony

  • 10 min
  • checkout

Appendix

What the letters mean

[R] Report (clarifying the information) - one person telling something to everyone, so everyone gets clarity on the subject, can ask questions, but not really discussion, etc

[E] Exploration (hearing reactions & ideas) - share our opinions, reactions, hear what everyone things, what’s on our mind
[D] Decision (making a decision) - final step to bring it together to a decision

List of ideas

  • making a tutorial(s), writing a manual/ handbook
  • future roadmap, plan
    • general direction for Karrot in the future? the conceptual part? more solid conceptual framework
  • in-person meeting \o/
  • ‘Legalizing’ Karrot? Building a legal structure we can use?
    • bank account/ legal structure, open collective
  • governance structure of Karrot/ Karrot ‘team’
  • Server structure, connection with foodsharing.de and Kanthaus
  • sociocracy and Karrot
  • how sociocracy could support groups
  • idea of commons
    • if there are shared resources in a group = commons (e.g. a cargo bike) can this be supported by karrot. e.g. a feature for shared items?
  • finding partnerships to do some on the ground testing. related to a funding or part maybe. (the idea that Nick explained recently), a network, a movement, outreach a more specific one
    • outreach: establish network and partnerships, maybe connecting with local movements
  • re-contextualise Karrot towards a more-generalised tool
  • a mind map of these ideas, to visualize and revisit them → have a focused session on this
  • Privacy Policy
  • agreement feature and group governance [Nathalie]
#10

Date: 2023-03-14 meet.jit.si/karrot
Facilitator: Bruno
Minutes: all
Participants: Nathalie, Nick, Bruno

1. Opening

  • 10 min Check in
  • 5 min ADMIN
    • attendance (write down participants)
    • duration: 1:30h
    • information: any (non-karrot) announcements? unavailabilities?
    • next meeting:
      • next Wednesday co-working: yes
      • next Tuesday general: Bruno won’t make it, meeting is happening
    • pick facilitator for next week: you? your karrot needs you!: Nick

2. Consent to agenda

  • 2 min

3. Review last week’s Actions/Outcomes

  • change the forum post accordingly [Vas] - done!
  • change the activity series [bruno] - done
  • write to Daniel [Nathalie] - done
  • engage with the thread about festival and workshop [all] - been read
  • contacting fosc people? try and get call after the 18th of March [Nathalie introduces each other] - done
  • jot down some thoughts [Nick to initiate that?] - done
  • make a time poll for a feedback session [vas]

4. Discussion points

  • find a time for design session/ retrospection session on roles feature [D]
    • would like to discuss roles vs membership, getting the concept clear
    • do a design process
    • would be nice to see how groups are using it, do it after/during the feedback session maybe
    • Nathalie has some ideas, but when/where should it be shared?
      • a quick one now then get the feedback
      • been thinking about the definition of roles, now it’s more connected to membership
      • role allows you to do something
      • assigning some specific tasks is what a role is (relating to sociocracy)
      • approved role and trust giving is more like a membership type
      • operative roles, like participant types: how can they be displayed?
      • volunteer, grassroots organisation might have a bigger need to define different types of membership
    • Reactions
      • questions: what should be coded and what’s open for the group to decide? editor a special role, leave it like that, approved role linked to participate in acticities, unsure what else should be in the software
      • roles related to participant types, comes and goes
      • new onboarding process involced new type of membership
      • idea of badges (board member etc)
      • would like clear concept of this besides the technical implementation
      • useful to think about what groups are like, make patterns visible, user and group needs
      • what do we want to support with Karrot?
      • exisiting groups and existing features, how to fuse the concepts
      • nothing in the software which is causing harm
      • love to enage with this kind of abstract thinking
      • editor role came out of a need for an admin function, more like a reaction
      • be more intentional about design in the future
    • draft making could happen already
      • create a thread on the forum is one idea
      • Nathalie could take responsibility - think about it
  • commons consortium eu funding thing [RE]
    • Next Generation Internet: "*** open call *** A 14M€ call is open for pilotin
" - EU Voice
    • Ivan from bonfire contacted Nick
    • direct EU funding thing - big
    • build a consortium of projects
    • open-source digital commons
    • projects in the consortium already funded by NGI
    • high-level vision: bunch of software as alternative
    • centered around coopcloud project
    • details needs to be worked out more
    • set up a Karrot instance by click (no admin knowledgde)
      • set up other tools alongside
      • maybe even integration
    • weave together all different software into federated network
    • money distributed to collective
    • democratic governance between all collectives and instances
    • Karrot side: fit Karrot into a system, not huge part for Karrot
    • short to deadline
    • they’ve contacted Sociocracy for All too
    • might be useful to have a call
    • Reactions
      • great management skills needed
      • nice vision
      • maybe Brunos friend from https://collective.tools/ would be interested
      • funny that Nathalie heard about it through FOSC/ SoFA
      • do we need a decision? feedback now would be could, somthing we can communicate to them
      • more clarity needed
      • how does federation come into it?
      • vision is now clearer
      • feel that we never discussed enough in Karrot about the issue of federation, but cool for Karrot to be there
      • skeptical about the organisational bit: do people know what they’re getting into?
      • that’s some big bucks there! and could ruin things
      • experience with projects that scale
      • who is leading it? bonfire and cloudcoop?
      • governance of he whole thing, regular meetings? general assembly?
      • for Karrot: do we want to work directly with it?
      • is federation a crucial part of it? is that a part of the vision to federate all the software?
      • still positive about it
      • up for rewriting some thoghts to put into matrix channel
      • concerns around EU bureaucracy(?)
      • federation as a governance org federation, tech federation as a bonus
        • org
        • similar software instances
        • across different software
      • how could Karrot relate?
        • pilot project
        • being core part of it
      • proposal within Karrot short-term
        • do we want to continue with this proposal?
      • set up a call with Karrot
  • nlnet funding [RE]
    • April 1 deadline
    • maybe bring to coworking
    • similar to what we did before
    • they have different names
    • NGI zero entrust
      • familiar names on list of projetcs
      • Karrot would fit into that
    • 5000 to 50000 proposals
      • could be a smaller one
      • or a bigger one?
    • motivation to get more money!
    • last nlnet went reasonably well
    • scale feels more do-able than the consortium thing
    • not such a daunting committment
    • up for thinking more about it
    • how clear do we need to be in the application?
    • might be worth going for!
    • offline process? build a sceleton
    • spread work over a longer period of time
      • 50.000 for 2-3 years?
    • concerns: making specific proposals for an MoU sets our priorities, and would be quite rushed
      • e.g. deciding in the next 2 weeks what we focused on for another year is not ideal
      • feels a bit like setting something in stone, kind of
  • some talk about our financial situations

Up next:

  • standing point: organizational structure [E]

5. Actions/Outcomes

  • engage again with the thread on new features ane do a time poll to meet and discuss and find a day for a co-working/design session [anyone co-working]
  • reply fosc e-mail [someone co-working]
  • rewrite thoughts and questions about EU funding to put it back into the matrix channel [Nick]
  • look into and prod about nlnet funding, and/or explore in co-working tomorrow [Nick]