mini version withough the chat and post on the forum
ready for NLnet
Q: has Nick started on sanctions? no.
Q: what about documentation? itās about design here.
Q: do you plan to bring it to another meeting before sending to nlnet? would be good I guess, not specific plans. no consent on it, sending to nlnet is independent. sending minimal version to nlnet, or maybe both?
when applying to a group, the name of the members replying to the applications are replaced by a question mark, but not in the email notifications. I was able to see name and surname of the people replying to me in the email notifications I received when applying (even though my application was never accepted)
when applying to a group, the name of the members replying to the applications are replaced by a question mark, but not in the email notifications. I was able to see name and surname of the people replying to me in the email notifications I received when applying (even though my application was never accepted)
have a look at the excalidraw, run through some features
another voice would be nice
maybe another post
facilitators? except for Nathalie?
Nick: should take on sth, need more thought for that, hand out space would be nice to have some kind of structure, might benefit of a bit of structure, break out rooms? probs could work. Karrot quiz? didnt prepare it yet but could be in small groups. Use some of the Karrot places.
Vas: bit with harmonica, very amateur, not professional, planning to have a script and a storyline, where weāre atā¦ some jamming and some text in betweenā¦ like the metaphor of being around the fire, so you can underperform alcohol free or have some alcohol? would be happy to have some on the sideā¦ maybe Nathalie can decide. when designing quiz, might not be enough people to do break out rooms? so maybe prepare activities to work for both scenarios
Bruno: might try to join after meeting, but cannot make it otherwise
Sofi: first time being in an online party so donāt know what itās going to be like, at parties people naturally gather into smaller groups, opening up my mind! regaarding alcohol, who is going to stop you
Nathalie: would probably not start with alcohol, but maybe a break before the hang out space, and invite people if they wanted to
10 people signed up!
take a look at funding work-pad from Siegen-people & address discussion pt.
Famtastisch - been chatting with @Philip Engelbutzeder about how structured an initial email should be, starting to write a draft, can think about whether the visions/values fit what weāre doing
many of the criteria seems to fit
they look at impact and method, do we have any idea about how to articulate our method, and the measurable impact
on the rest of the places
two EU funding
there is a workshop on how to write EU funding applications, Sofi will attend
Philip is enthusiastic about the Karrot district tour
Nick: measuring impact, interesting as none of the applications have put it that
Vasilis: like the measuring impact point, however skeptical about the reports
Karrot has no legal status, not a legal entity, university funding would be better
think of mathematical approaches for measuring impact, look more towards environmental impact, footprints
community-building is more crucialāgood communal practice prevents wrongdoing within food-sharing practitioners
CSA is an aspect
at some pt traditional market will take care of food-waste, communities will lack excuse to existā¦
Bruno: disagree that they will solve the issue, doesnāt cost them to throw it away, could be part of our argumentation for the funding application
other use cases for Karrot, general purpose, dont have many other groups, very few. food system in general as long as there is the capacity to work on that
legal entity: we can apply with our fiscal host (all for climate), fee there. thatās one possibility
measuring impacts: food waste saved can be a good measurement, human connections, community building, number of activities done
āSharing knowledge and best practices and creating coalitions and alliances between equal and unequal parties; reinforcing infrastructures for collaboration.ā
āAs a foundation, we want to move away from project-based funding and towards long-term, unallocated support for our partner organisations. This requires a great deal of trust on both sides, and it takes time to get there. We admit that we have not reached our goal yet; however, we began issuing our first unallocated funding in 2024.ā
āThe eight call of NGI Zero Commons Fund opened up on June 1st 2025, with a deadline of August 1st 2025 12:00 CEST (noon). Check out the guide for applicants and the frequently asked questions.ā
Bruno:
one approach for Famtastisch one, look at existing projects/groups and make an argument for digital sovereignty, to try and fulfil their digital needs with Karrot
try to replicate Jayās security issue and document it [someone]
keep working on the accessibility report topics [Nathalie]
do final review of sanctions design preparing for RFP (crossing Tās and dotting Iās kind of thing) [Nathalie]
commit to doing something for release party [Nick in coworking tomorrow]
Jay: sorry, my phone died so I canāt hotspot (and canāt connect to the Karrot call with wifi here) so I can only type. Will charge my pony and be back
2 karrot district tour - it is a project idea! who wants to do this - Nick?
3 hear more about possible project ideas
Reactions
Nick
up for karrot tour with Butze!
doing our strategy would help clarify common direct and project ideas
focused on nlnet work at the moment
how to wrap up pieces into a whole āprojectā?
interactions with karrot group but not being a member, public sign-up, - breaking boundary of groups
expanding beyond food, picking another use case and seeing how karrot can work
method of organising, e.g. sociocracy
Nathalie
maybe team up more with sociocracy for all? combining training expertise, and connecting to networks of groups, which can maybe try out karrotā¦ and some research around that?
accessibility - deeper dive to make it more accessible? reviewing navigation/menu organisingā¦ user interface design work
āprogressive interfaceā - how to present the right level of complexity to a user, e.g. new users donāt need to see everything. making things clearer/easier to understand, and how to manage complexity (as karrot gets more complex, how to deal with it)
commons-theme? how can we support organising common things, e.g. calendar view, physical objects (e.g. shared bikes) - but yet another feature! so complexity to manage
food district tour: could be nice to have parts more team oriented, expand beyond nick and butze, so perhaps some parts of it, e.g. particularly in warsaw could be interesting for Nathalie, or visiting Bruno.
Nick
use of messengers (whatsapp, telegram), bridge communication channel
final backend self-review, then merge! then sanity test on dev.karrot.world by someone else? [Nathalie]
develop sanctions feature - 3000 [Nick]
The Big One
big feature hardly any time, panic/stressā¦. what to do?
documentation for roles/permissions - 1000 [Vas]
dependent on it being done!
wait for it to be merged/deployed and Nathalie tried it out
Nathalie then up to explain to him how it works
documentation for sanctions - 1000 [Vas]
this more tricky! as itās not clear what will emerge and when
security & accessibility - 500 [Nick, Nathalie]?
hoping to have that done later, as itās small, and I think nlnet already suggested that would be ok!!!
maybe will not do or later?
develop permissions - 2000 [Nick]
Nathalie:
sense with nlnet is they might be flexible? e.g. security/accessibility amount is quite low, but can we shift some money there?
checking money, got 3000 done but not RFP + self-hosting docs (1000) + roles (2000), vas will likely do docs (1000). could we reallocate money?
doubt the sanctions will be a nice process given the roles processā¦? maybe leave out sanctions by reallocate a bit, but lose a bit, and a bit longer deadline?
Nick
permission money into roles? claim it together
sanctions most difficult one, much reduced scoped version, only knows when starting to do it
try to push deadline out and code on sanctions
unlock speed
pushed documentation for roles even later
shift money from permissions to roles and security
deadline extension?
āYes, end of June is fine. (The EC has been so kind to reduce the time pressure on our side somewhat, so we can also be a bit more relaxed; though we still aim to finish all Entrust projects this summer.)ā
5. Actions and Outcomes
reply to the sideways thing [Nick] IX
submit nlnet rfp for instance options [Nick] VII
submit invoice [Bruno, Nick] V
read bristol days forum post draft [Nick] I
try to replicate Jayās security issue and document it [someone] I
keep working on the accessibility report topics [Nathalie] I
look at outreach email to famtastic [Nathalie]
write on wall: consult team for District Tour and bring back to meeting [Sofi]
write an email to nlnet with content from the notes above [Nick/Nathalie]
check with vas about documentation tasks [Nathalie]
when applying to a group, the name of the members replying to the applications are replaced by a question mark, but not in the email notifications. I was able to see name and surname of the people replying to me in the email notifications I received when applying (even though my application was never accepted)
āCreating urban co-creation spaces for driving sustainable food system transformationā
co-creating sustainable urban spaces for better food systems! nutritious food for vulnerable groups, being less wasteful, etcā¦ resilience, exclusivity, health
not just eu proposals, but writing proposals that are not academic, for receiving government money with industrial interests
short term proposals to produce knowledge, but to achieve other impact/results
specific guidelines for those
went through an example (see funding pad)
difficulty including karrot in it, because karrot is not a registered legal entity, could get funding as a research team, and transfer some to karrot?
where are we in the process? do we have consent on one design?
Nick
a bit of mess without consent, because design is approved as a task
design does not cover all of implementation decisions
have to work out how to bridge the gaps
without consent, there is more uncertainty
with deadline, needs to be coding and not talking, potentially stressful
progress clarifies a lot of things
nice way of process: accept the mess and pick out things with most resistance (currently the visibility topic; maybe find a 3rd way)
take feedback during progress
welcomes inputs on visibility
Jay
understand the stress of having to focus on coding while needing to talk and consent
trusts Nick to make the right decision
even imperfect, keep deadline in mind and maybe develop more later
Nathalie
we have currently more implicit consent, need more explicit consent, especially about visibility
understands that Bruno submitted his minimal version of design to NLnet, but conversation is not over
the above is not explicitly stated, which effects implementation
did not bring back minimal design back to meeting, should do it
we can find a solution just for now, in view of deadline
meanwhile we can already talk about proposals
Sofi
deadline and making a decision
good to stay with something we can minimal agree on
karrot continues after the deadline!
Next step
check for consent in the next meeting
continue conversation outside meetings
Next time
Think about NLnet Commonās Funding project (deadline 01/08)
feedback log
@Jay reporting an issue (as a Karrot user in FS Lux): when the time of a pickup is changed, the person signed up is removed from the event and thereās a lot of conflicts coming up lately because of people taking āsomeone elseāsā slot when a person is removed. Is there some UX work we could do to prevent this?
@Jay pointing out a feature/bug we could work on (maybe simple coding task if someone feels like addressing it?): on pads, when a text has a link (like here, for example), there is no way to actually open it, since clicking on it simply moves the editing cursor to the text. Maybe implement something like CTRL+click ā opens link in new tab?
@Jay proposed karrot to a local non-profit (helping refugee integration)
current setup is a preview of the link being the same (karrot logo, generic info)
but new behavior would be that the link is previewing a specific activity or group on Karrot
AI proposal NCL university [R] [Vas]
rejected
āBad news, they are basically looking for more technical proposals ā we should be more specific next time about the types of AI technologies we will use during these participatory engagements. Lets think about potential venues for re-submissionā
sanctions design
check for consent of design
finding a nice finish for the design
would be good to look at sth, latest design bruno provided, check if there is sth we do not consent
looks good to me, transparency vs privacy? could each group decide how it works?
Jay
looks nice, some negative feelings, maybe wording? feeling punitive
also have a deadline
Nick
new info the who can see this
how it will be shared is not on the mockup
the heart of the issue lies in transparency vs privacy and do not want to decide on myself on that during actual dev
Vas
a bit confusing, but maybe wasnāt fully focused
how did someone get to be a mediator? how do they know they need a mediator? or there is an issue needing mediator? how does the mediator role work?
Nathalie
noticing not explicit how to get mediator role, not sure if mockup assumes self-assignment mediator role
Sofi
no urgent questions, understood mediator part now
Jay
no comment, makes sense
Nick
still need to get some clarity on how the outcome will be shared?
question marks?
reports on the list? who are they?
self-assign might not be enough
Vas
probably makes no sense to see ongoing list of issues with question marks
self-assignment does have this box to explain the group process to the the role if there is another process they should go through
what happens if you have multiple mediators and there is a conflict between them, but thatās an edge case
can you still directly start a membership review?
Nathalie
no strong feelings about the list of ongoing issues? could just show how many ongoing issues?
about showing outcome, logged in history log? sanctions/names? but not access for detailed pages, only outcome information
for overview list, could show still-active sanctions, maybe donāt need a very obvious place to see all history of people
if you can just assign mediator role? is that enough of a barrier?
maybe include a delay in getting the mediator role (or getting access to the view) before you can assign as mediator for an issue? 1 month? 2 weeks? or only new reports?
other way of getting roles, declare your interest in a roleā¦ and get it by another process, but thatās all a bit further away
Nick clarifications:
lot of confusion on wording with āissuesā
two types of issues, often ambiguous
outcome of a report is a decision that may include a sanction
comment and archive is not a sanction but still a decision
extra concept is the ādecisionā
not specified how decisions can be āreversedā. Not gonna implement that
include history log with ādecisionsā
currently there is no list of concluded issues, history doesnāt include details
Nathalie
particularly have a need to show the sanctions
Proposal:
take Brunoās design
canāt reverse/change decisions
show outcome
outcome = decision + any sanction + any comment + who the mediator was + who the report was about (not the initial report, or the reporter)
accessible, but not too visible
outcome in history log
show outcome on issue overview
self-assign mediator role
Consent round:
Nathalie
would like to have some kind of commitment to explore the self-assigned role
happy to consent in the propsal as it is
Sofi
understands there are tensions, but the current version is well reasoned
consent
Jay:
accessible but not to visible bit
Consent
Vas
consent
only comment is āaccessible but not visibleā bit, donāt see why to have it in proposal, adds more confusion
Nick
I consent!
we reached consent
Think about NLnet Commonās Funding project (deadline 01/08)
skimming through the link (which link? commonsfund link I guess) web4, internet of things
maybe getting a bit of an overview of what theyāre looking for, and what direction to move towards (e.g. web4), thinking in web4 waysā¦ which is maybe beyond our capacity
some foodsaving initiatives with smart fridges etc. open
seems different to previous calls, a bit more advanced, going more into physical realm
have hard deadline 25th July, after that can contribute to proposal itself
nathalie
enjoyed the energy, enthusiasm
a bit sad it didnāt get the full attention it deserved, but appreciating it
sounds promising, motivated to get involved
wasnāt super clear what is seen in the nlnet proposal
would like to pay attention to how detailed or openness we can have, regarding the design processā¦ previously we submitted almost predetirmined outcome for the design processes
it has a lot of impact on our priorities weād work on
Sofi
will read past applications + nlnet call to see what theyāre looking for
chose more development-related things, rather than food-related ones
@Jay reporting an issue (as a Karrot user in FS Lux): when the time of a pickup is changed, the person signed up is removed from the event and thereās a lot of conflicts coming up lately because of people taking āsomeone elseāsā slot when a person is removed. Is there some UX work we could do to prevent this?
@Jay pointing out a feature/bug we could work on (maybe simple coding task if someone feels like addressing it?): on pads, when a text has a link (like here, for example), there is no way to actually open it, since clicking on it simply moves the editing cursor to the text. Maybe implement something like CTRL+click ā opens link in new tab?
thought we found something (and written something during the workshop with AI help) and Philip got in contact with a person who said itās not ready yet! approx. 4 months in preparation
Horizon proposals
Person says
13 millions euros
2 projects will be funded
highly competitive
excellent proposal
10-20 different project partners
1. good proposal: national contact person for proposals, give us drafts of upcoming proposals
2. get together consortium: work together with people you know and like to work with - be aware of conflicts! can be challenging
from Graz, research center there
could imagine being lead together with Philip
network of people who do stuff in EU countries
great opportunity! 6 million ā¬
EU urban system for sustainable food
huge amount of money
similar call in February and September
and karrot?
not every EU call is inter/ trans disciplinary
food sharing/ community building perspective
invite karrot and foodsharing
karrot would be a partner! (one of them)
Philip would apply as researcher of Siegen
a lot of work!
establish consortium
donāt know if it will turn out
need someone experienced on my side
bigger thing than karrot!
need to think about it for myself, will have a look into this
clear draft what to do before seeking partners - collaborative writing impossible to manage
continue conversation in coworking and next meeting
Later
feedback log
@Jay reporting an issue (as a Karrot user in FS Lux): when the time of a pickup is changed, the person signed up is removed from the event and thereās a lot of conflicts coming up lately because of people taking āsomeone elseāsā slot when a person is removed. Is there some UX work we could do to prevent this?
@Jay pointing out a feature/bug we could work on (maybe simple coding task if someone feels like addressing it?): on pads, when a text has a link (like here, for example), there is no way to actually open it, since clicking on it simply moves the editing cursor to the text. Maybe implement something like CTRL+click ā opens link in new tab?
there is a room that ppl can use, and Nat is getting involved
common resources use-case
mainly to book the room
motivated to improve German translation in the next weeks @Nathalie
statistics from Daniel, Luxembourg instance, total 608 user
59 German
88 Luxemburgisch
130 French
All For Climate Response
wrote back, looks like its gonna be an ongoing convo
āAll For climate does have experience with European projects as we currently are hosting an Erasmus+ project.
However I would like to put you in contact with our team member Antonis (in cc) whoās managing the project and who has a lot of experience in applying for these type of grants.
But please already share what exactly you would like to apply for, elaborate a bit more on the project, is there a need of partner organisations, who will lead the project?ā
will go through that together, vas and nat, co-working on Wednesday
feedback log
@Jay reporting an issue (as a Karrot user in FS Lux): when the time of a pickup is changed, the person signed up is removed from the event and thereās a lot of conflicts coming up lately because of people taking āsomeone elseāsā slot when a person is removed. Is there some UX work we could do to prevent this?
Bruno will add to feedback log
@Jay pointing out a feature/bug we could work on (maybe simple coding task if someone feels like addressing it?): on pads, when a text has a link (like here, for example), there is no way to actually open it, since clicking on it simply moves the editing cursor to the text. Maybe implement something like CTRL+click ā opens link in new tab?
reminded of the fee, which forgot to include in the overview
Nick:
recurring topic
relevant also for tax situation
discuss in money circle
5. Actions and Outcomes
Continue correspondence with All for Climate [Sofi]
@Jay reporting an accessibility issue (for colour-blind individuals) on login page when wrong password is entered (red text on brown background) - bring to forum [Jay]
test āblock access from group* for more than 1 year [Bruno]
add nathalieās list on the pad to the forum, and nickās [Bruno]
check if money circle is schedule and if not, do it [Bruno]
Date: 2025-08-12 on Karrot
Facilitator: Vas
Minutes: everyone/no-one
Participants: Nick, Sofi, Nathalie, Bruno, Philip, Vas
1. Opening
10 min Check in
attendance:
duration: 1h, possible extension if needed
information? any (non-karrot) announcements? unavailabilities?
Nathalie is gonna be away throughout next week
Vas likely away beginning of September
Nick next week away
next meetings:
co-working:
wednesday: its not taking place
thursday: vas, nick (maybe)
weekly: vas,
extra: Monday 18th August for funding
pick facilitator for next weekly meeting: Vas (tentatively)
2. Consent to agenda
2 min
3. Review last weekās Actions/Outcomes
Continue correspondence with All for Climate [Sofi]
ongoing
@Jay reporting an accessibility issue (for colour-blind individuals) on login page when wrong password is entered (red text on brown background) - bring to forum [Jay]
test āblock access from group* for more than 1 year [Bruno]
add nathalieās list on the pad to the forum, and nickās (sanctions feedback) [Bruno] I
check if money circle is schedule and if not, do it [Bruno]
done
4. Discussion Points
updates - R
famtastisch feedback (sofi)
rejected pretty quickly,
looking for ppl who are more ambitious to reach out to political organisations, systemic change
suggested other organizations and partnerships to apply for
if we partner up, CSA for example, more political organisations
Nick: appreciate communication
what I read from email exchange, less focused on grassroots change, more into institutions (systemic change), legitimate ārejectionā
when big funders give money to grassroots, they handle over āpowerā to the grassroots
should grassroot need funding?
Sharing Food Tour (philip)
most valueable, nicest thing I ve been doing, activism and research
going with the main dev of foodsharing.de, listen to them, try to undestand the guiding principles, collect ideas, make sense of how we can improve the platform, try to understand how we can support, lot of fun
5 districts already, 6 to come
idea to implement: the resource mosaic, 3 kind of pillars
functionality on the platform
analogue platform
workshop format
we go on the meeting when new ppl join, rules, etc, can be boring, often when ppl join are there to save food and also join an initiative, main funcitonality is towards functionality, the foodsaving machine, 10ppl take most of the tasks, cleaning the fs points, get more frustruted, wkshops we ask them what do you really like to do, to bring it in a local org, we write down several diverse resources they want to share, and then we think of ways to pool these resources to create new āthingsā.
foodsharing adding this functionality
concept: 5 pages, we ll test it with some districts
Nathalie: quick thought, foodsharing dev is vibrant, public activities now! its like Karrot! similarities of thoughts, showing resources
Nick: I think its very nice, opening up quite a new paradigm of what might be possible, unlock the resources and connect them together (reflection from earth first)
sofi: 5 pages concept will be interesting to look into that
how you do that in an online platform, start sharing your resources?
whatās the difference of that and a mutual aid society, probs the same
Vasil is: reminded him of an old project where ppl bring together resources
global commoning system
reminded of the roles system of Karrot
not just about what ppl can bring, but what they would like to experiment with; to avoid reproducing stereotypes (IT ppl like to do something not IT); also what to do with ppl who donāt have resource but like to contribute
the system can promote the users to put their resources together
Bruno: happy to read the concept or blog entry
can facilitate digital parts and features
the question is how the culture is, or how to prompt the culture of thinking in terms of sharing; features alone is not enough, unless there is already culture of sharing
workshops are helping in that direction
Butze: thanks for the feedback; does not believe that features alone are enough; workshops are meant to foster culture;
advantage with starting w/ food-sharing is that there is already a culture
design challenge: how willing are ppl to share certain resources, especially urgent and āinstrusiveā resources
how to make it open-source tool, an open-source alternative like doodle for appointment-finding ā open source tool of ressource sharing, where foodsharing.de is the catalyst for (both in ressources from foodsharing.de and with people from foodsharing who bring it to other communities)
another purpose of bringing this up here: can be very helpful for the design of Karrot
grassroot development takes a lot of time, maybe will take 3 years for Karrot and Foodshairng to partner up
Nathalie: talked with Anton, discussed about foodsharing towns project and foodsharing
small funding for Karrot as part of the Foodsharing Sweden project
pillar: our own instance of karrot, get together diffferent groups on the same instance,
focused on the region where the funding comes from, will make available infrastructure for the whole of sweden, to start their fs initiaive, contacts, guidelines
6k EUR as an estimation. Budget will be defined tomorrow 13/8
reserved some money for Karrot itself, how can we use that? How we would like to commit?
deploying our instance, require some money, external partner which in this case is Karrot to do that, appx 6k
need to check for invovices through All For Climate
to support deployment and development of own instance (we can separate what is of interest to us as the Karrot team to work and what is for the FSS people to work on)
to pay for travel costs to Gothenburg for a Foodsharing workshop
when? part of Butzeās tour?
using money to do a karrot team gathering + workshop, connecting that to the Sharing Tour
March could be a good month to do a meeting
Reflection round:
Sofi: glad to bring some money, should we discuss on how we use later on?
Nick: sounds good initiative, finding someone else to manage the instance, fits with my growing interest of visiting some places in europe, got a big europe anxiety, border biometrics to avoid bio ID, whole details which can come later on, logistics, money aspects etc
Butzer: like touring around, brainstorming on what we can do, talk on it next monday, or do a sep meeting, like to do that
Vas: in line with giving power to the groups themselves. Second what Nick said about someone else managing the instance.
Bruno: 6k is for Karrot, 30k total budget, whole project, 60K co-financed in kind and volunteer work
if approved the start of the project will be in Nov, its likely that we get the money
we decide internally how we put the money in use
Butzer: proposal call, frame it as more sociotechnical, instance and social support of kickstarting projects
nlnet final hurdles? (+ deployment)
vas: working on tutorial for sanctions
nick: i think that everything
will do a follow up on email with NLnet ppl
still somethings, sanctions is ok to be rfped but a few bugs before production
sort of things that impact on how it works? I dont think so
Continue correspondence with All for Climate [Sofi] (ongoing)
@Jay reporting an accessibility issue (for colour-blind individuals) on login page when wrong password is entered (red text on brown background) - bring to forum [Jay] I
test āblock access from group* for more than 1 year [Bruno] I
add nathalieās list on the pad to the forum, and nickās (sanctions feedback) [Bruno] I
Date: 2025-08-26 on Karrot
Facilitator: Bruno
Minutes: everyone/no-one
Participants: Nick, Sofi, Bruno, Philip, Jay
1. Opening
10 min Check in
attendance:
duration: 1h30
information? any (non-karrot) announcements? unavailabilities?
Nick working on something else for the next two weeks
next meetings:
co-working:
wednesday: Bruno, Jay, Nick (tentative)
thursday: Jay
weekly: money circle. Bruno, Jay, Nick, Sofi
pick facilitator for next weekly meeting: Jay
2. Consent to agenda
2 min
3. Review last weekās Actions/Outcomes
Continue correspondence with All for Climate [Sofi] (ongoing - waiting for reply)
@Jay reporting an accessibility issue (for colour-blind individuals) on login page when wrong password is entered (red text on brown background) - bring to forum [Jay] II
test āblock access from group* for more than 1 year [Bruno] I
add nathalieās list on the pad to the forum, and nickās (sanctions feedback) [Bruno] I
applying to the German research foundation (basic research) and a call about food supply chain
trade-off between resilience and sustainability. Feeding the poor is not a sustainable model
Karrot as an international can be suitable for this call
how to move forward, how can he and Sofi support?
Nick
three pathways:
Nlnet application
go ahead with a strategy session
explore peopleās intuitions within their own spaces (for ex. Butzeās or Brunoās)
meeting reflected the phase of leaving the intense focused work, more exploring
Sofi
remembers Nathalie got excited about asking for donations or crowdfunding
doing it more consciously, one concrete suggestions
interested in strategy call
there are some plans, small things we could do
Jay
read the minutes and agree with Nathalie about user donations
single users or communities that have access to some funding
also interested in a strategy call
projects can be a bit distracting of what we want to do, instead of taking the time to build what we want to do
Bruno
agree with everything thatās been said
depends on energy we can put into it
summing up
small donations from community members
meta theme on strategy
vas got demotivated in CSS after the paper rejection, so had his own strategy
recognising we have different ideas
strategy session could support alignment between our differing perspectives, and how different ideas can relate or support each other
shooting at different targets approach, nlnet, research, css
Butze
understand better
will continue to explore more things by himself and talk to Sofi
Nick
strategy session will be a good idea, interested in hearing from Sofi and others what strategy means to them and collaborate on doing the session
āculture eats strategy for breakfastā - root it in our culture and personal intentions, not as traditional strategy based on external things like profit
emergent strategy is the term he likes (book by Ann-Marie Brown)
an informal chat sometime this week, or asynch thread?
call on the second half of September
Sofi
new field for her
will check the book but not much time to read the whole thing, will do a little research
happy to support and join a call
available after a few weeks
Jay
not much to add, agrees that strategy is important
tricky, if itās already defined as open data itās fine, but how open is it now?
currently would need technological access, as need to use the API, regular users canāt go about and collect the data
as long as we are sure this data doesnāt impact privacy, and we have good documentation on Karrot it should be fine
and need to be a member of the group to access the data
clarification:
this is about exporting data and sending it to him
the data is available for all users by clicking around reading
he may have used the API to get data similar to the activity statistics page
Jay
is it someone asking data from a group he is part of?
if yes, should be ok, if itās a one time thing
if people often request data maybe we should do a feature
it opens a lot of questions
Sofi
it would be nice to make it to a feature
suppose it wonāt compromise privacy a lot
a bit strange if that is not open and transparent to others
no strong opinions about this
Nick
makes sense as a feature but not a priority
itās semi-anonymous, because it has user ids, so people in the group can know who it is
feedback text is there, which might contain information
would not consider this anonymous, but it is data that all the people in the group could see anyway, so consented
Proposal: accept request, on the basis that he is a member of the group and that he shares it on the wall to make it transparent for the group and available for others
consent: Nick, Bruno, Jay (and honoury consent from non-member Sofi)
reflection about being more involved in the governance and management of data
what is needed before deployment? [nick]
focused on Nlnet: good enough to merge but not necessarily bug-free
some things may cause chaos in groups, a lot of features, needs some through beta-testing
@Jay reporting an accessibility issue (for colour-blind individuals) on login page when wrong password is entered (red text on brown background) - bring to forum [Jay] I
@Jay reporting an accessibility issue (for colour-blind individuals) on login page when wrong password is entered (red text on brown background) - bring to forum [Jay] II
last in april, havent invoiced which I d like to invoice pref in the next weeks, 1200ā¬ total (May to August)
prefers going through open collective
would like to keep the 300
the money helps, brings flexibility
flexible about direct payment, no strong opinion
Nick
how to manage payment? we have money, e.g. pending nlnet money
6000 euro currently + 4000 after approval of final thing + 1000 after vas is paid
calculate what months we can pay in full and pay until then
not sure if we can resume payments ongoing
money is running low; not critical but at a low point; Karrot money is significant
direct income form nlnet counts as donation and hence tax free; going through karrot again turns it into taxable income
not using open collective make it less transparent, difficult to bookkeep
personally: benefits of direct payment outweighs disadvanatges
Sofi
donāt need money; pass
Bruno
has got 2500 EUR from nlnet in personal account waiting to be transfered
1200 EUR outstanding until August
would like to do the direct payment
flexible about when to get payed
happy to keep the same amount
Jay
Still okay with not being paid
No preference on how the payments are delivered
Planning to change jobs in about one year; until then Iāll be fine financially
Vas
moneywise: if not draining the project, happy to stay with the same amount
only stable source at the moment; got job from Switzerland, not sure when will be paid
no preference for direct payment
can work out the logistics later
make sense to commission and support open collective
Overview:
Outstanding
Nick: (paid up to feb) 6Ć500 = 3000
Nathalie May 4Ć300 = 1200
Bruno? looks like paid up to feb. 6 Ć 200? = 1200
Vas (paid up to december 2025) = 230 Ć 8 = 1840
1840 + 1200 + 1200 + 3000 = 7240 (up to and including august)
money available
ā¬2,188.18 (in open collective
6000EUR + 4000EUR on nicks account
2500EUR on bruno account
+ 1000 that will be after vas has RFPād
10000 + 2500 + 1000 + 2188.18 = 15688.18
Round on continue payment
Nathalie
frustrated on the money process; ppl should be clear about what they have and how much they expect
work didnāt really happened between 2 months ago and now
āwhen looking at it briefly, given everything stays the same, we get all the nlnet money and pay our outstanding payments and no other income, we could end the year with ~ +3700ā¬ā
not sure how to improve the process wrt they standing on the issue on money
happy to pay everything until August and come back in a month
Bruno:
proposal: zero account on outgoing payments until august
maybe also ask for explicit consent on: do we do direct payments? or through OC?
another money circle in a month to figure out the rest
maybe we should have a treasurer
Sofi and Jay pass
Vas:
happy to proceed with payment until august
having a mix of direct and OC payment might be complex, but could also work
need to keep track of direct payments, ppl can do it on their own, maybe maintain account history on Karrot
^could eliminate the need for a treasurer
11th or 12th will RFP the tutorial; cannot invoice before then
what to do in the case of Nick? does he keep the $$$ for future outstanding payment?
Proposal
get your money everyone!
pay until August 2025 (including August)
itās ok to keep nlnet money directly
prolong amounts for September
next money circle in 1 month
prepare!!
how much nlnet money is still on your account
what you want to go forward with
consent?
Q: transfer money to oc?
itās ok to still keep it in your account, as in 1 month we check the numbers again
updates - R
Sanctions/Membership review tutorial
a bit postponed, until after Vas bike trip
help with starting issues on devās Makerspace group
German translations
Daniel jumped in 99.9999% translated on dev
in the process discovered a few issues with the karrot code, opened some issues
Come up with a treasurer or a system to keep track and have an overview?
5. Actions and Outcomes
write to bartosz about csv report [nick]
more beta-testing [bruno] I
@Jay reporting an accessibility issue (for colour-blind individuals) on login page when wrong password is entered (red text on brown background) - bring to forum [Jay] III
Date: 2025-09-09 on Karrot
Facilitator: Bruno
Minutes: all
Participants: Jay, Bruno, Nathalie,
1. Opening
10 min Check in
attendance
duration: 1h
information? any (non-karrot) announcements? unavailabilities?
Jay wonāt be there next week
next meetings:
co-working:
wednesday: Bruno, Nathalie, Jay
Thursday: Jay, Nathalie maybe
weekly: Bruno, Nathalie most likely
pick facilitator for next weekly meeting: up for grabs!
2. Consent to agenda
2 min
3. Review last weekās Actions/Outcomes
write to bartosz about csv report [nick]
more beta-testing [bruno] I
@Jay reporting an accessibility issue (for colour-blind individuals) on login page when wrong password is entered (red text on brown background) - bring to forum [Jay] III
can someone make an item for it on community? Jay has no access to community (since one month; technical issue)
on laptop: stuck on loading (before sign-in)
on smartphone: stuck on sign-in (after entering password)
Come up with a treasurer or a system to keep track and have an overview?
5. Actions and Outcomes
write to bartosz about csv report [nick] I
more beta-testing [bruno] II
@Jay reporting an accessibility issue (for colour-blind individuals) on login page when wrong password is entered (red text on brown background) - bring to forum [Bruno] III
Date: 2025-09-16 on Karrot
Facilitator: Sofi
Minutes: Bruno
Participants: Sofi, Nathalie, Bruno, Vas (later)
1. Opening
10 min Check in
attendance (fill in above): Sofi, Nathalie, Bruno
duration: 1 hour
information? any (non-karrot) announcements? unavailabilities?
Nathalie might take a bit of time off in September
next meetings:
co-working:
wednesday: Bruno, Nathalie (for 1h)
Thursday:
weekly:
Sofi might not be here next week
pick facilitator for next weekly meeting: Bruno as a backup
2. Consent to agenda
2 min
3. Review last weekās Actions/Outcomes
write to bartosz about csv report [nick] I
more beta-testing [bruno] II
@Jay reporting an accessibility issue (for colour-blind individuals) on login page when wrong password is entered (red text on brown background) - bring to forum [Bruno] III
they donāt feel like big tasks, it will always come up
unpleasant if they accumulate
have a rotating schedule and everyone takes care of the tasks for 2 weeks
Bruno
formalise roles, use the role! (and the upcoming feature)
be it a group responsibility - risk of not getting it done
do it the sociocratic way?
having multiple ppl in charge might lead to ppl leaving it to others
we are currently not that active, so might be good to have reminders
there is also the issue of how: how do we accept new members? (maybe nice to write on the wall)
confused applicantsā¦ sometimes ppl did not find the right place
could do more of these tasks no
Nathalie
we do have the options of formalizing non-formalizing, open either way
raising awareness if we have a group responsibility: what do you feel responsible for?
we could that second round, but maybe not for today?
fine if things happen, but noticed things do not happen, making me unsatisfied
want to make sure this is not invisible work, likes when it comes up in last weekās actions and outcome
maybe welcoming new ppl is its own topic, has some reflections on it, how to engage and facilitate the group
what do you feel responsible for?
Sofi
doesnāt feel entitled to speak for group, not sure to respond to emails
taking on tasks that we all agreed upon on e.g. finance
do we need consent on replies?
welcoming new people, ask them to introduce on wall
Bruno
feel responsible for keeping up with certain lvl of activity, which comes in waves
when we are at the low point of the wave, things donāt get done
something unsure about whether Iām doing enough for Karrot
introducing new members: prompting new ppl to introduce themselves might be intimidating
just a welcoming message could be helpful
could bring up again next week
Nathalie
understood the question in particular for household task
feel responsible for keeping things going
like to engage with OC and accept things: quick and easy and not challenging
wrt emails and new members: donāt always want to do this
concerned about letting go of the responsibility: it will just not get done
feel responsible for taking things to the meetings when tasks are left hanging
hesitant about going into the role of doing these things; would prefer doing other tasks for Karrot
Vas
pass
update on tutorial [Vas]
working on it, and itās gonna be ready anytime soon!
Next meeting?
reflection/pause/cycles? [nick]
welcoming new people
Come up with a treasurer or a system to keep track and have an overview?
5. Actions and Outcomes
write to bartosz about csv report [nick] II
more beta-testing [bruno] III
@Jay reporting an accessibility issue (for colour-blind individuals) on login page when wrong password is entered (red text on brown background) - bring to forum [Bruno] IV
Date: 2025-09-23 on Karrot
Facilitator: Nick
Minutes: anyone
Participants: Nick, Nathalie, Bruno
1. Opening
10 min Check in
attendance (fill in above):
duration: up to hour, and extend if we need more time
information? any (non-karrot) announcements? unavailabilities?
away a bit, mostly at the weekendā¦
next meetings:
co-working:
wednesday: Bruno, Nathalieā¦
Thursday: no-oneā¦
weekly STRATEGY SESSION!!! omg!!!: Sofi, Bruno, Nathalie, nick
pick facilitator for next weekly meeting: Nick
2. Consent to agenda
2 min
3. Review last weekās Actions/Outcomes
write to bartosz about csv report [nick] II
more beta-testing [bruno] III
did some, but can do more
@Jay reporting an accessibility issue (for colour-blind individuals) on login page when wrong password is entered (red text on brown background) - bring to forum [Bruno] IV
at the bottom there is a āTentative sketch of sessionā
Nathalie
happy to attend, looks really nice
wonder about the timingsā¦ time for inner reflection, then a round?
following your lead
really want to scroll up and read other things, what does form, storm, norm meeeeeean??
at some point we wondered how much we want to introduce other practises, still have tarot cards, but seems not fitting into this? how much do we want to play with different prompts? not proposing anything elseā¦ can still do something another time, e.g. in person in gothenburgā¦
looking forward to it
Bruno
re-reading the first list including orgasmic meditation practise from adrienne maree brownās list
have bigger design processes, connected to funding, but alsoā¦
we have some smaller features that could benefit from a mini design process, so theyāre ready for implementation in the future
trying to find another little task to work on in the future
maybe could include some of these into the next funding? or other people joining who want to contribute?
can we review the board, and clean it up?
maybe after release + after the strategy, motivated to have a look at some medium-sized design processes, in penpot, etcā¦
personal motivation - Iāve been adding a few things, having used karrot with local neighbourhood group
Bruno:
have to admit the board has been a bit abandoned from my side, for last months
doesnāt mean not motivated to put some order there, cleanup
getting quite bigā¦ tendency is to get biggerā¦ not really a clear priority order, except ānext upā, but not really updatedā¦
others donāt mean priority order, maybe have some tags?
lots of relatively small stuff that would be good to focus on, but still like to put it into the bigger picture/context of the strategyā¦ what is the time periodā¦ hopefully will emerge in the strategy sessionā¦
Nick:
work in sprints in other projects, what goes into which period of work
clearer sense of our seasons, at the end of each one is a pause, next period coming up now, what shall will put in it?
issue boards get big and accumulate
place where stale things go, like seeds that can be reactivated, āseed boxā
do it in the context of the strategy session
board a bit frustration, doesnāt feel nice to use it
get community to upvote on features, engage wider karrot users
framing tasks intro a coherent idea
Nathalie:
as strategy session is upcoming, can see how it can come together
agree the board feels a bit added to discourse, a bit clunkyā¦ how much do I want to rethink the whole system, or just progress on some things? or just find something I can work on?
noticing I have some space for karrot work, but not a clear sense of what to do
some lingering tasksā¦
main takeaway - a need for shaping the tasks in a nice package
Bruno:
if looking for someone to discuss/explore finding a task, feel welcome! talk through somethingā¦
For the future:
welcoming new people
Come up with a treasurer or a system to keep track and have an overview? [?]
reflection/pause/cycles? [nick]
5. Actions and Outcomes
write to bartosz about csv report [nick] III
more beta-testing [bruno] IV
@Jay reporting an accessibility issue (for colour-blind individuals) on login page when wrong password is entered (red text on brown background) - bring to forum [Bruno] V
continue on finance app [Jay] II
look at how feedback works and think how it could be [Nathalie]
alcohol free or have some alcohol? would be happy to have some on the sideā¦ maybe Nathalie can decide. when designing quiz, might not be enough people to do break out rooms? so maybe prepare activities to work for both scenarios
and be back
DONE 
(sofi)
in 
)
(self-deprecating criticism around sanctions)
not directly related to new featuresā¦
